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Thread: Spirit Airlines orders up to 100 jets

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    Spirit Airlines orders up to 100 jets


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    Slated for delivery over the next several years. Article states they operate 140 jets, so that's HUGE growth. Sounds like an OUTSTANDING opportunity over there in the next few years. They are also ripe for merger which would give its pilots better future bargaining power. Compared to LCC AA, they're not bogged down with orders and options for the withering 737 Max which I'm convinced many passengers will avoid threatening revenue and profits, don't have more debt then Delta and United combined and do have many better QWL items AA pilots don't have, especially LTD. Definately worth investigation and consideration IMO.

    Caveat Emptor.
    Last edited by Beagleboy; 10-23-2019 at 07:01 PM.

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    If you want to get to AA, have to go to Spirit first.

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    Quote Originally Posted by NoOtPilot View Post
    If you want to get to AA, have to go to Spirit first.
    Agreed, but at 9 + years via flow, IMO just about anywhere is a better path if your goal is the waning LCC AA. I fully expect in the future, Spirits contract will be superior to AA’s in Group II metrics and QWL. Almost there now anyway.

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    What's your point here? The Mesa of the LCCs places an MOU for an aircraft order. They may not even take one aircraft. They have a horrible product and are by far the bottom of the barrel in customer reviews. On their earnings call their earnings per share decreased 15% year over year for the 3rd quarter. AA? Well, EPS BEAT estimates. You always ask for hard facts. I just gave you some. You are not going to be able to refute any of it other than by just kicking up a bunch of dust and making a fuss here. It doesn't change the fact that AA is solidly profitable and it's only going to continue to get better.

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    I was recently over on Regent Blvd and stopped by and talked with 5 pipeline new hires who were in class. They are all to a man so very grateful to be at Envoy. Each of them recounted that they only wanted Envoy from the time they began flight training as it was their dream to work for American Airlines. One of the guys lived near Philly and had been running flow scenarios and looking at AA retirements post flow and with a sub 6 year flow, he figured he should be able to hold PHL 330 in 5 years. So, Just a smidge under 11 years from new hire at Envoy to the right seat of a widebody. In anybody's book this isn't too bad at all. Take heed guys. Don't let the grifters here try to reel you in with paper aircraft orders for a bottom feeding LCC. Who in their right mind would work there anyway when you have a guaranteed seat at AA. A "DA" that's who. Or a grifter like BB or one of his cronies. But they wouldn't either really, they just have the jealous complex going.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dacuj View Post
    I was recently over on Regent Blvd and stopped by and talked with 5 pipeline new hires who were in class. They are all to a man so very grateful to be at Envoy. Each of them recounted that they only wanted Envoy from the time they began flight training as it was their dream to work for American Airlines. One of the guys lived near Philly and had been running flow scenarios and looking at AA retirements post flow and with a sub 6 year flow, he figured he should be able to hold PHL 330 in 5 years. So, Just a smidge under 11 years from new hire at Envoy to the right seat of a widebody. In anybody's book this isn't too bad at all. Take heed guys. Don't let the grifters here try to reel you in with paper aircraft orders for a bottom feeding LCC. Who in their right mind would work there anyway when you have a guaranteed seat at AA. A "DA" that's who. Or a grifter like BB or one of his cronies. But they wouldn't either really, they just have the jealous complex going.


    Look, it was a 5.5 year flow when Envoy had 50% of every new hire position and only 1850 pilots to flow....
    AA had retirements over 3700 in just over 5.5 years. That is mathematically provable.
    To try and claim it's still a 5-6 year flow with only 29 flowing a month, (and soon to be much less flowing each month), is just a lie.
    The math doesn't work. Stop selling lies
    Last edited by Cujo665; 10-24-2019 at 03:00 PM.
    __________________________________________________ __

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    You do know no one cares what you say or think. As for the cadets who cares since they have no clue as to what they talk about now go back to the toilet bowl dive in and flush yourself. Mgt stooge
    Just an opinion held by most.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dacuj View Post
    What's your point here? The Mesa of the LCCs places an MOU for an aircraft order. They may not even take one aircraft. They have a horrible product and are by far the bottom of the barrel in customer reviews. On their earnings call their earnings per share decreased 15% year over year for the 3rd quarter. AA? Well, EPS BEAT estimates. You always ask for hard facts. I just gave you some. You are not going to be able to refute any of it other than by just kicking up a bunch of dust and making a fuss here. It doesn't change the fact that AA is solidly profitable and it's only going to continue to get better.
    My points (plural) are pretty evident. No surprise you don't see them (more like don't want to see them). You're right though, they might not take one aircraft as after all, it's contractual. You remember that term, yes? No different then the Envoy flow which is also "contractual". No guarantees there either and you know it. But, considering past history and the predictable behavior of the players. I'd bet Spirit (or any successor airline) is more likely to exercise most, if not all of its orders vs. AAG/Envoy living up to their flow promises over the next 5 years or so.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dacuj View Post
    I was recently over on Regent Blvd and stopped by and talked with 5 pipeline new hires who were in class. They are all to a man so very grateful to be at Envoy. Each of them recounted that they only wanted Envoy from the time they began flight training as it was their dream to work for American Airlines. One of the guys lived near Philly and had been running flow scenarios and looking at AA retirements post flow and with a sub 6 year flow, he figured he should be able to hold PHL 330 in 5 years. So, Just a smidge under 11 years from new hire at Envoy to the right seat of a widebody. In anybody's book this isn't too bad at all. Take heed guys. Don't let the grifters here try to reel you in with paper aircraft orders for a bottom feeding LCC. Who in their right mind would work there anyway when you have a guaranteed seat at AA. A "DA" that's who. Or a grifter like BB or one of his cronies. But they wouldn't either really, they just have the jealous complex going.
    Although this post is very likely an embellished claim or possibly even an outright lie (you are already a liar by your own admission), lets just say you are telling the truth for a change. There might just indeed be 5 pipeline puppies who feel that way and good for them provided they accept the risks of their choice and have done their due dilligence to feel comfortable that the promises made meet their expectations. But, many pilots feel differently, especially those who have lived the Envoy lifestyle for awhile. As for your assertions any particular pilot will be flying Group 4 at LCC AA in X years, that is assumption.

    * Note to all, our exhalted village idiot here again psychologically projects a term I intitially used to describe him (accurately), that being the term "grifter". Obviously, he is bankrupt of any originality and this should be considered IMO yet another red flag of someone with a history of nothing BUT red flags. As always, Caveat Emptor.

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    Group 4 at AA in 5 years is not an assumption. Have you looked at the retirements? Where do you think the large majority of those come from? Right. Group 4. This guy was extremely smart and had calculated the numbers at Envoy and AA using complicated algorithms far more accurate than that union site. Sitting right seat in the 330 before your 33rd birthday is indeed the fastest, best and most accurate track to that seat. He, and all 5 guys I spoke with, all in the 23 to 24 yo range, are all 175 to boot. Doesn't get much better than that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dacuj View Post
    Group 4 at AA in 5 years is not an assumption. Have you looked at the retirements? Where do you think the large majority of those come from? Right. Group 4. This guy was extremely smart and had calculated the numbers at Envoy and AA using complicated algorithms far more accurate than that union site. Sitting right seat in the 330 before your 33rd birthday is indeed the fastest, best and most accurate track to that seat. He, and all 5 guys I spoke with, all in the 23 to 24 yo range, are all 175 to boot. Doesn't get much better than that.
    ALL future prognostications are ASSUMPTIONS.....ESPECIALLY when it comes to AA and the flow-thru. The LAST opinions ANY pilot should use as most accurate are those of juiced up Envoy cadets who know not the first thing about AA-Eagle history and the flow-thru. Nice try, kid..............another swing and a miss.

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    Ah yes, the seemingly never ending ramblings of a chronic masterbatory alcoholic never fail to entertain.
    Keep it up Spooge!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dacuj View Post
    Group 4 at AA in 5 years is not an assumption. Have you looked at the retirements? Where do you think the large majority of those come from? Right. Group 4. This guy was extremely smart and had calculated the numbers at Envoy and AA using complicated algorithms far more accurate than that union site. Sitting right seat in the 330 before your 33rd birthday is indeed the fastest, best and most accurate track to that seat. He, and all 5 guys I spoke with, all in the 23 to 24 yo range, are all 175 to boot. Doesn't get much better than that.
    ”Have you looked at the retirements?”
    ~Dacuj~

    If you ONLY look at the retirements, you’re going for a BIG surprise.

    You will be attempting to cross a mayor highway during rush hour looking only to the right side. You won’t even know what happened and how you ended up where you are.

    14 months away before the clock ⏰ stops. Not to worry APA will have a signed contract before 2021.
    APA is not & will never be the same. Unlike Frank Lorenzo, Doug Parker WILL succeed! And the BOD knows, Parker is “The Man” for the Job.
    Last edited by NoOtPilot; 10-26-2019 at 07:17 PM.

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    I remember something about counting your chickens before the eggs hatch.

    If he was so smart, why did he even run all these “algorithms” We have had flow thru pilots go right to the 757/767.
    Maybe he should worry more about how to fly a regional jet, and worry about his wide body later.

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    I remember something about counting your chickens before the eggs hatch.

    If he was so smart, why did he even run all these “algorithms” We have had flow thru pilots go right to the 757/767.
    Maybe he should worry more about how to fly a regional jet, and worry about his wide body later.

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    Quote Originally Posted by NoOtPilot View Post
    ”Have you looked at the retirements?”
    ~Dacuj~

    If you ONLY look at the retirements, you’re going for a BIG surprise.

    You will be attempting to cross a mayor highway during rush hour looking only to the right side. You won’t even know what happened and how you ended up where you are.

    14 months away before the clock ⏰ stops. Not to worry APA will have a signed contract before 2021.
    APA is not & will never be the same. Unlike Frank Lorenzo, Doug Parker WILL succeed! And the BOD knows, Parker is “The Man” for the Job.
    Even Frank Lorenzo agreed with Doug Parker the year of “The Merger.”

    https://www.thestreet.com/amp/story/...-it-right.html
    Last edited by NoOtPilot; 10-26-2019 at 07:18 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Earl View Post
    I remember something about counting your chickens before the eggs hatch.

    If he was so smart, why did he even run all these “algorithms” We have had flow thru pilots go right to the 757/767.
    Maybe he should worry more about how to fly a regional jet, and worry about his wide body later.
    This is NOT your grandfather's "American Eagle." This is Envoy....wholly owned by AAG....who also wholly owns American Airlines. One and the same brah. Along the same lines, we don't hire "American Eagle" pilots here. American AIRLINES pilots are hired. Why do you think all of the time and effort was invested in establishing the pipeline program? So that the best and brightest end up in American Airlines cockpits. This isn't 1987 when Envoy just hires some Baron driver flying for Virgil Pickens Oil Co outta West Texas. Envoy hires pilots that have been highly educated and have learned all of the ins and outs of 121 flying from day one in their accredited college. Notice I said "educated" and "college" hint hint DEGREE. Unlike that 1987 Baron driver I mentioned, the pipeline cadets are degreed in addition to being highly trained and ready to hit the ground running on day one of indoc.

    So, back to your point. This new hire was extremely bright and had a very complex algorithm showing his flow date plus or minus one month and track to the 330 right seat with approximately 2 months error on either side. Yes, I and he are very aware that some new hires go right into the 75/76. However, this individual lived in Philly and only wanted 330.

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    Actually american eagle was owned by amr who owned american and when you were hired at eagle you were on the flow list to american, nothing new at envoy but new to psa and pdt. Stop acting like envoy has done something original. Oh but the way legacy eagle was able to send 50 percent of the new hire class at american while envoy is at 29, 1/3 the class and come February 2020 it will go to 15 per month for 20 percent of new hire class at american. So envoy is worse than legacy eagle in size of flows. Maybe you should watch more e175 videos in the bathroom.
    Just an observation.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ardvark View Post
    Actually american eagle was owned by amr who owned american and when you were hired at eagle you were on the flow list to american, nothing new at envoy but new to psa and pdt. Stop acting like envoy has done something original. Oh but the way legacy eagle was able to send 50 percent of the new hire class at american while envoy is at 29, 1/3 the class and come February 2020 it will go to 15 per month for 20 percent of new hire class at american. So envoy is worse than legacy eagle in size of flows. Maybe you should watch more e175 videos in the bathroom.
    Just an observation.
    Incorrect sir. You are either as dumb as a rock or lying. I'm 100% going with the former. When I was hired in 07, THERE. WAS. NO. FLOW. THROUGH.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dacuj View Post
    Incorrect sir. You are either as dumb as a rock or lying. I'm 100% going with the former. When I was hired in 07, THERE. WAS. NO. FLOW. THROUGH.
    That’s odd I was at Eagle in 2007 and flowed later!!

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