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Thread: Your boss can give you a raise and then just take it away.

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    Registered User NoOtPilot's Avatar
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    Your boss can give you a raise and then just take it away.


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    There is probably little you can do about this. Your employer can give a raise and take it back, just as it can reduce/increase your hours, change your schedule, increase/decrease your pay, require you to work overtime (as long as it pays you), prohibit you from working overtime, etc. However, what the employer cannot do is rescind or take away a raise becuase of your race, religion, gender, national origin, disability, age, or sexual orientation (or becuase you complained of discrimination.) It is probably best to contact a few attorneys directly and that should give you a better idea as to what you can do about this.

    Donít expect ALPAís help.

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    Dont worry the increase in rates to the company funded insurance is going to eat the whole pay pay raise. Welcome to the New American Airlines, synonymous with US Air.

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    Inflation will take a bite too ...

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    Registered User NoOtPilot's Avatar
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    Thatís assuming they donít walk away...again.

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    Registered User ardvark's Avatar
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    Southwest is going to share its payments from Boeing with its employees where is the largest airline in the world on this.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ardvark View Post
    Southwest is going to share its payments from Boeing with its employees where is the largest airline in the world on this.
    The opposite. Theyíll need concessions to offset losses that wonít be recovered.

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    Registered User NoOtPilot's Avatar
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    https://images.magnetmail.net/images...Pay_signed.pdf

    Has Envoy Management confirmed to the pilot group in any kind of communication of the changes to the CBA announced during the week of July 27th, 2019?

    Wonder if they walked away from the modifications to Section 3 of the CBA in regards to new hourly rates and the annual 1% increase effective January 1st of each year?
    Last edited by NoOtPilot; 09-12-2019 at 02:27 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Beagleboy View Post
    The opposite. They’ll need concessions to offset losses that won’t be recovered.
    Is this a fact backed by numbers or just an opinion?

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    Quote Originally Posted by NigelNey View Post
    Is this a fact backed by numbers or just an opinion?
    Opinion.

    Look at the profit sharing realities whereby management awards themselves fat awards while the pilots for example get 1% and change. Look at Delta, United and now what occurs at Southwest. The next pilot contract which also IMO is years away, will have concessions.

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    Quote Originally Posted by NoOtPilot View Post
    https://images.magnetmail.net/images...Pay_signed.pdf

    Has Envoy Management confirmed to the pilot group in any kind of communication of the changes to the CBA announced during the week of July 27th, 2019?

    Wonder if they walked away from the modifications to Section 3 of the CBA in regards to new hourly rates and the annual 1% increase effective January 1st of each year?
    Does it not say they have until Sept 30th to determine the method of the retro? What am I missing?

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    Quote Originally Posted by ardvark View Post
    dont worry the increase in rates to the company funded insurance is going to eat the whole pay pay raise. Welcome to the new american airlines, synonymous with us air.
    yes!

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    Update: Enhanced Pilot Pay Timeline September 9, 2019

    Envoy Pilots Ė The agreement that was recently reached between Envoy and the Air Line Pilots Association (ALPA) provides you with increased pay rates, retroactive to June 1. We continue to work with Payroll to make all of the necessary adjustments in our system. For this reason, your Sept. 13 paycheck will still reflect your base pay at the old rate of pay for Sept. 1-15. We anticipate that the new rates will be reflected in your Sept. 30 paycheck. We will provide more information soon about when you can expect your retroactive payments for the months of June, July and August. We appreciate your patience as we make the necessary updates to our system to support the new pay rates.

    No signature🤔🤔

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    They better have our 401k contributions corrected also with the pay raise from June 1 2019

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    Quote Originally Posted by NoOtPilot View Post
    No signature樂樂
    You posted a picture with the only signatures that matter. Why the tinfoil hat on this one?

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    Guess I'll try the Dacujian sales pitch for a change only in opposition.

    To wit, speaking of bosses that don't take away pay (or QWL which are interrelated), just heard that Delta is going to ramp up hiring significantly next year. Hearing as many as 75/month or 8-900 for the year (exact numbers unconfirmed as of yet though). That's huge. Delta is hands down the #1 pilot employer for compensation and QWL among the two top tier legacies left due to a management team that makes "all the right moves". Only two top tier legacy carriers left and Delta is #1 with United the follower. Considering the other LCC's are going to hire strongly like AA, there should be plenty of options and opportunities to make the move to larger jets, pay checks and QWL now instead of maybe many years from now. Top tier legacy airlines are where a pilot wants to end up, but some of the other LCC's aside AA are catching up. My advice has always been to think long-term and look at the big piucture and stability. The past has many lessons to teach about the future, but you've got to pay attention.

    As always though, Caveat Emptor.
    Last edited by Beagleboy; 09-13-2019 at 12:45 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Meatloaf View Post
    You posted a picture with the only signatures that matter. Why the tinfoil hat on this one?
    1st is not a picture.
    2nd Key words such as: ďWe anticipate...We will provide more information...Ē
    3rd Nobodyís signature on this communication, on behalf of your management team.

    So, who is taking responsibility for this information?
    Definitely not a clear picture. Old rates from December 31, where in place by January 15th.

    What is different this time?
    Last edited by NoOtPilot; 09-13-2019 at 02:56 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by NoOtPilot View Post
    1st is not a picture.
    2nd Key words such as: “We anticipate...We will provide more information...”
    3rd Nobody’s signature on this communication, on behalf of your management team.

    So, who is taking responsibility for this information?
    Definitely not a clear picture. Old rates from December 31, where in place by January 15th.

    What is different this time?
    1. This mac opened in a web browser as https://images.magnetmail.net/images.... My mistake I thought is was an image not a PDF but whatever
    2. Nothing to see here
    3. Again that doesn't mean anything at all

    Are you predicting that the agreement is not maintained by the company?

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    Registered User NoOtPilot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Meatloaf View Post
    1. This mac opened in a web browser as https://images.magnetmail.net/images.... My mistake I thought is was an image not a PDF but whatever
    2. Nothing to see here
    3. Again that doesn't mean anything at all

    Are you predicting that the agreement is not maintained by the company?
    🤣No worries! Predicting is such a big word, why donít we use wondering...based on recent history.

    Donít forget... Your employer can give a raise and take it back...There is probably little you can do about this. And is completely legal.
    ~ABC Law Group,NY...~
    FLSA (Fair Labor Standards Act)
    Last edited by NoOtPilot; 09-13-2019 at 05:23 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by NoOtPilot View Post
    🤣No worries! Predicting is such a big word, why donít we use wondering...based on recent history.

    Donít forget... Your employer can give a raise and take it back...There is probably little you can do about this. And is completely legal.
    ~ABC Law Group,NY...~
    FLSA (Fair Labor Standards Act)
    Airline employees are exempt from FLSA

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    The company was supposed to decide within 30 days (of July 25) whether they could figure out the actual retro pay or opt to pay us the 20 hours per month. There has been no concrete communication from the company about which we are to receive. I've "heard" the company is "leaning" towards the actual retro pay, but that's pretty wishy washy BS. Math is hard.

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