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Thread: 2010 - 2018 Flow %

  1. #41
    Registered User Dacuj's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ardvark View Post
    Hey, you makeCDyour choice and live with and shut up. Facts are the facts. The only difference at aa is higher pay, same **** everything else. Aa is a large LCC, what that bother your ego.
    I am not trying to spread the **** to make it look like margarine on toast you and your friends are. Aa sucks and envoy sucks. Just chose which blow job you prefer.
    Is English your first language? How the h*** did you even graduate from high school?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dacuj View Post
    Is English your first language? How the h*** did you even graduate from high school?
    How did you make it out of kindergarten ? Too much booze can explain your own embarrassing grammar, but it can’t explain all of your shortcomings.

  3. #43
    Registered User Dacuj's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beagleboy View Post
    How did you make it out of kindergarten ? Too much booze can explain your own embarrassing grammar, but it can’t explain all of your shortcomings.
    My grammar is very good thank you very much. Review my posts. I am very clear and concise and use the written language to convey TRUTH. Something you know nothing about. Remember, I have been in Mensa before. I would bet next year's salary that you would never be able to be admitted as a Mensa member. Do you just lurk about these boards all day waiting to jump on any dissenters that won't join your little hate train?

    Envoy is #1!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dacuj View Post
    My grammar is very good thank you very much. Review my posts. I am very clear and concise and use the written language to convey TRUTH. Something you know nothing about. Remember, I have been in Mensa before. I would bet next year's salary that you would never be able to be admitted as a Mensa member. Do you just lurk about these boards all day waiting to jump on any dissenters that won't join your little hate train?

    Envoy is #1!
    Your grammar isnít bad when you are sober, But, that makes your content even more disturbing considering you canít blame alcohol for it. IMO, thereís an underlying psychological disorder in play whether you truly believe what you post or just lavish at being an accomplished troll.

    Like it or not, with every post you make, Envoy looks worse. They are the only true casualty in your little game.

  5. #45
    Super Moderator Cujo665's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Koojo View Post
    Well, sounds like all that and a bag of chips but I think we both know there is some heavy embellishment in this statement. Let's keep this thread on track shall we?

    Envoy had provide 56% (FIFTY SIX PERCENT) of the flows to AA since 2010.
    Zero embellishment whatsoever. Entirely factual. I left out the part about strawberry ice cream because I knew it would be too much for some of you.... but yes, we get ice cream on the Hawaii flights.
    We get crew cars in training, not hotel shuttle vans
    we have Company Uber accounts to use when authorized
    company credit card for emergencies, airport lounge fees, and any last minute travel fees
    aircraft has two satellite phone systems and each plane has its own cell phone so we don’t have to use ours Internationally
    no airport standby or ready reserve
    no junior manning off duty, yes you can answer your phone.
    company provided LTD is 60% of regular pay
    Short Term Disability is available as an option up to $4k a month.
    Full boat family plan PPO global coverage is $434 a month. Add in every insurance option possible and I pay just under $800 a month with coverage for everything including legal services.
    retirement is the weak spot. It’s just a match like Envoy. They do 1/2 of what you contribute up to 10%.

    when you flow or go someplace outside of the regionals you’ll finally realize just how badly AAG regionals treat their employees. My starting pay was $113 an hour, our top step is $20 an hour more than United on the same equipment ($297), I’ll never ever need a crash pad, I get confirmed seats to/from work and I keep the award points... we keep our hotel points at most chains also. It sure makes taking family vacations easy. Award tickets with real seats, not standby. Nice hotels for free on award points. I’ll take one or two long trips over 3-5 trips a month anytime. If I bid right I get almost a month off without using any vacation time. I fly 25-50 hours a month.

    does it have the size and trip variety of a legacy, nope.... but I’m okay with that.

    it is an ACMI although it’s unlike most of them. We own our aircraft outright except for two. We primarily do DoD work or other federal agencies, some of which I can’t discuss, and we do fill in for a few airlines on occasion. In summer we do the Air Lingus Boston to Dublin route. Which means my home basing is to company Uber 20 minutes to work. We don’t have a single cargo plane, they’re all pax.

    cool screen name Kooj.... think of that all on your own did ya?
    Last edited by Cujo665; 11-27-2018 at 06:08 PM.
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  6. #46
    Registered User ardvark's Avatar
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    Oooh what dacuj said.
    Meatloaf, apology. I know aa compared to envoy is better, never said envoy was , but you know if you are beaten every day and then you go elsewhere where the beatings are every other 2 days, I am sure they would say it's great at the new place.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cujo665 View Post
    most excellent. Thanks for asking. We had over 850 applications at the last hiring window.
    Iím getting mostly Western Hemisphere or Tokyo/Seoul and lots of Vegas & Honolulu. Only had to go to the sandpit once all year. Loved Limerick Ireland and I visited relatives in Germany on a 4 day layover. Pay is fantastic, crews are outstanding, maintenance is far above average (did I mention we carry two mechanics on every revenue flight and about 3,300 lbs of spare parts and consumables for repair if needed. Home based and never have to worry about a jumpseat to work. The Delta FA came mid flight to apologize that first wasnít available because my status warranted free upgrade. No crashpads. Best of all a management that actually acts like part of the team instead of ball busting morons trying to outdue each other on how they can squeeze more from another employee. Scheduling is polite and never makes veiled threats. Itís exceptionally stress free, fun work, and pays well. Weíve taken multiple 2-3 week vacations without using a single vacation day. Just creative line bidding. The B767 is a fantastic machine. The inflight meals are typically steak or roast chicken.... far better than trail mix. Iím currently in Atlanta doing left seat work for new hires in the sim. They had one get dropped just before sim, so they needed somebody to help. Short on instructors with the increased hiring and upgrades. So I volunteered to help administer some torture.
    Come on man let's be honest, Yokota/ isn't Tokyo and Osan isn't Seoul, hell ICN really isn't Seoul. Nobody likes Limerick ( Are you guys still in the Southcourt), I mean Irish people don't even like Limerick. HHN and RMS are in the middle of no where, and I am calling BS on the Delta FAs story. I am a Delta Diamond, and was a 360 (It is above Diamond) last year. I get postcards just about every time I fly and get driven to my gate in a Porsche most days and I have never had a FA apologize on the rare few times I didn't get the upgrade.

    Having said all that, ROZ is one of my happy places, and the pop up AMC flying is some of the coolest flying I will ever do and most of the 121 guys will never get to do it. Going in to NKW is a awesome feeling and knowing the limited number of people have ever been there is very cool.

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    Is it 16 on in a row and the rest off every month ?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dvtpilot View Post
    Is it 16 on in a row and the rest off every month ?
    No idea about Cujo's shop but most ACMIs are a mix of large blocks on 14-20 depending on the airline smaller trips. Right now I have been bidding the smaller trips and low time lines, between that and holding overnights at home I am averaging 8-10 nights away from home a month. The last time I bid the long SYD trip I was gone was for 15 days in a row, most of the AMC flying is also done with one long trip.

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    Quote Originally Posted by gonzo View Post
    No idea about Cujo's shop but most ACMIs are a mix of large blocks on 14-20 depending on the airline smaller trips. Right now I have been bidding the smaller trips and low time lines, between that and holding overnights at home I am averaging 8-10 nights away from home a month. The last time I bid the long SYD trip I was gone was for 15 days in a row, most of the AMC flying is also done with one long trip.
    Whereís the this at? Doesnít sound too bad

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dvtpilot View Post
    Where’s the this at? Doesn’t sound too bad
    All the ACMI airlines are hiring, I would pick one to apply at depending on where you live and what kind of flying you want to do and your home life.

  12. #52
    Registered User Koojo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cujo665 View Post
    Zero embellishment whatsoever. Entirely factual. I left out the part about strawberry ice cream because I knew it would be too much for some of you.... but yes, we get ice cream on the Hawaii flights.
    We get crew cars in training, not hotel shuttle vans
    we have Company Uber accounts to use when authorized
    company credit card for emergencies, airport lounge fees, and any last minute travel fees
    aircraft has two satellite phone systems and each plane has its own cell phone so we don’t have to use ours Internationally
    no airport standby or ready reserve
    no junior manning off duty, yes you can answer your phone.
    company provided LTD is 60% of regular pay
    Short Term Disability is available as an option up to $4k a month.
    Full boat family plan PPO global coverage is $434 a month. Add in every insurance option possible and I pay just under $800 a month with coverage for everything including legal services.
    retirement is the weak spot. It’s just a match like Envoy. They do 1/2 of what you contribute up to 10%.

    when you flow or go someplace outside of the regionals you’ll finally realize just how badly AAG regionals treat their employees. My starting pay was $113 an hour, our top step is $20 an hour more than United on the same equipment ($297), I’ll never ever need a crash pad, I get confirmed seats to/from work and I keep the award points... we keep our hotel points at most chains also. It sure makes taking family vacations easy. Award tickets with real seats, not standby. Nice hotels for free on award points. I’ll take one or two long trips over 3-5 trips a month anytime. If I bid right I get almost a month off without using any vacation time. I fly 25-50 hours a month.

    does it have the size and trip variety of a legacy, nope.... but I’m okay with that.

    it is an ACMI although it’s unlike most of them. We own our aircraft outright except for two. We primarily do DoD work or other federal agencies, some of which I can’t discuss, and we do fill in for a few airlines on occasion. In summer we do the Air Lingus Boston to Dublin route. Which means my home basing is to company Uber 20 minutes to work. We don’t have a single cargo plane, they’re all pax.

    cool screen name Kooj.... think of that all on your own did ya?
    Cool story brah. I'll see your tall tale and raise you with some hardcore facts.

    1.Sign-on bonus – Receive large sign-on bonus on your first day of training.
    2.Rotor Transition Program – We help rotor-wing military pilots become airline pilots in just a few months!
    3.Profit sharing – Envoy employees participate in American Airlines Group Profit Sharing.
    4.Industry-leading pay – Envoy has nearly doubled its First Officer starting pay to nearly $38 per hour.
    5.Enhanced Part 121 Program – Experienced Part 121 pilots can earn up to $45,000 sign-on bonus and upgrade to Captain in under six months!
    6.Career path – A new hire today is projected to upgrade to Captain in about one year with the fastest guaranteed flow to American of all regional airlines. By the end of 2017, nearly 1,300 Envoy pilots will be flying with American.
    7.Fleet quality – Envoy operates more than 150 Embraer and Bombardier regional jets, and is currently receiving 40 new 76-seat Embraer 175 aircraft, with options for 90 more.
    8.Exceptional training – Envoy has a reputation for leadership in airline pilot training and is highly respected among its industry peers.

    9.Travel privileges – Free and unlimited personal travel for you and your family on the world’s largest network with the same boarding priority as American Airlines employees.
    10.Highest safety standards – Safety has and always will be our #1 priority.
    11.Cadet program – Get paid to earn your flight hours while enjoying the benefits of being an Envoy employee in the Envoy Cadet Program.
    12.Company paid – ATP/CTP Course, iPad Air 2, Global Entry, and Known Crewmember.
    13.Preferred crew bases – Envoy shares hubs with American in Dallas/Fort Worth, Chicago, Miami and New York (La Guardia), with paid hotels for training and commuting.
    14.Direct entry Captain slots for qualified aviators.




  13. #53
    Registered User ardvark's Avatar
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    Most you stated are inaccurate. Last time I checked the contract first officer pay rates are still the lowest, your talking about the loa which is temporary. Bonus money is because the flow sucks and can't attract. DEC is because fo's dont want upgrade to pos qol.
    But you keep on selling that swamp land.

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    ...and Envoy FOís also have the largest pay cut in the industry on their 2nd year.

    Fastest guaranteed flow to AA?
    What happened to the 5- 6 years? False advertising? Thatís right, if nobody else has a flow, that makes our the fastest. Even at 11 years to flow.

    Lotís of Direct entry Captains slots to be filled by 175 Compass Captains.
    Coming Soon!

    And if they get Date of Hire, is going to get ugly.
    Last edited by NoOtPilot; 11-28-2018 at 09:41 AM.

  15. #55
    Super Moderator Cujo665's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gonzo View Post
    Come on man let's be honest, Yokota/ isn't Tokyo and Osan isn't Seoul, hell ICN really isn't Seoul. Nobody likes Limerick ( Are you guys still in the Southcourt), I mean Irish people don't even like Limerick. HHN and RMS are in the middle of no where, and I am calling BS on the Delta FAs story. I am a Delta Diamond, and was a 360 (It is above Diamond) last year. I get postcards just about every time I fly and get driven to my gate in a Porsche most days and I have never had a FA apologize on the rare few times I didn't get the upgrade.

    Having said all that, ROZ is one of my happy places, and the pop up AMC flying is some of the coolest flying I will ever do and most of the 121 guys will never get to do it. Going in to NKW is a awesome feeling and knowing the limited number of people have ever been there is very cool.
    Yeah, I was shocked too when she stopped by to recognize my status. I’d never seen it before either. Maybe she’s just an overachiever on customer service. She was in the aisles way more than the others. It’s never happened before. It may have been a fluke, but it happened.

    I enjoyed all those cities. Transportation was easy and lots to do.
    Its easier to say Toykyo and Seoul for people to know what your talking about. Not everybody knows Yokota or Osan. However....Yokota is technically part of Tokyo, it’s in the Tama Area, western Tokyo. Plenty of easy ways to get downtown. Same for Osan/Seoul which has both subway and train connection.

    Really enjoying the job here.
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  16. #56
    Super Moderator Cujo665's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dvtpilot View Post
    Is it 16 on in a row and the rest off every month ?
    We have a good variety in our bid packs. You’ll get plenty of 16 straight starting at various times during the month, and you’ll also get lines with two blocks of days in varying length that total 16 days.... 8/8.... 10/6.... 9/7... it varies. Positive space to/from your trip, you keep the air miles. No crashpads ever. PM me your email and I’ll shoot you over an expired bid pack to look at.

    We are highly specialized, really focused on DOD and other federal agencies. We fly 25-50 hours a month on average. You’ll deadhead out from home on day 1-3 and the day before the scheduled flight. I’ve never been deadheaded from home to fly that day. You’ll do the flight the next day, then stay in that city 2-5 days on RSV... (think mini vacation) then you’ll either fly or DH out to someplace else to do it again. After the next 2-5 days mini vacation you’ll DH home. On longer trips you’ll get days off duty and 30 hour at hotels. They do not count towards your min days off monthly. There are other nuances but that’s fairly typical. You can get an in country RSV assignment too which is fly or DH someplace and sit RSV RAP in that city for a week or more. No airport standby reserve.

    Some of the flying is extremely challenging. Other parts are just very different. Hearing the Iranian military shouting out warnings on 121.5 to invading aircraft is different, especially when you realize they’re talking about you. Apparently they routine bust balls even when you aren’t in their airspace (we were over 25 NM outside). Seeing all the methane fires from the oil field pump burn off at night is amazing. Seeing it once was enough though. I avoid the sandpit.
    Last edited by Cujo665; 11-28-2018 at 10:25 AM.
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  17. #57
    Super Moderator Cujo665's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dvtpilot View Post
    Where’s the this at? Doesn’t sound too bad
    The places with the best pay and rules right now are Kalitta and Omni. I wouldn’t write Atlas or Southern off either as they’ll eventually get a good deal, and once that happens competition for the job will increase greatly. Southern is doing a job fair in LGA Nov 30 at the LGA Marriot. Omni had over 850 applications in the first 3 days the last time the window opened. The Omni window opens again Dec 1st.

    omni starting is $88k or $109k depending which program you bid into or can hold.
    Last edited by Cujo665; 11-28-2018 at 10:30 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by NoOtPilot View Post
    ...and Envoy FO’s also have the largest pay cut in the industry on their 2nd year.

    Fastest guaranteed flow to AA?
    What happened to the 5- 6 years? False advertising? That’s right, if nobody else has a flow, that makes our the fastest. Even at 11 years to flow.

    Lot’s of Direct entry Captains slots to be filled by 175 Compass Captains.
    Coming Soon!

    And if they get Date of Hire, is going to get ugly.
    Your twisting the facts. That doesnt apply to people getting hired right now. Take a look at the projections. In 2016, a new hire was projected to flow to AA in less than 5 years. Get your facts strait.

  19. #59
    Super Moderator Cujo665's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Koojo View Post
    Cool story brah. I'll see your tall tale and raise you with some hardcore facts.

    1.Sign-on bonus – Receive large sign-on bonus on your first day of training.
    2.Rotor Transition Program – We help rotor-wing military pilots become airline pilots in just a few months!
    3.Profit sharing – Envoy employees participate in American Airlines Group Profit Sharing.
    4.Industry-leading pay – Envoy has nearly doubled its First Officer starting pay to nearly $38 per hour.
    5.Enhanced Part 121 Program – Experienced Part 121 pilots can earn up to $45,000 sign-on bonus and upgrade to Captain in under six months!
    6.Career path – A new hire today is projected to upgrade to Captain in about one year with the fastest guaranteed flow to American of all regional airlines. By the end of 2017, nearly 1,300 Envoy pilots will be flying with American.
    7.Fleet quality – Envoy operates more than 150 Embraer and Bombardier regional jets, and is currently receiving 40 new 76-seat Embraer 175 aircraft, with options for 90 more.
    8.Exceptional training – Envoy has a reputation for leadership in airline pilot training and is highly respected among its industry peers.

    9.Travel privileges – Free and unlimited personal travel for you and your family on the world’s largest network with the same boarding priority as American Airlines employees.
    10.Highest safety standards – Safety has and always will be our #1 priority.
    11.Cadet program – Get paid to earn your flight hours while enjoying the benefits of being an Envoy employee in the Envoy Cadet Program.
    12.Company paid – ATP/CTP Course, iPad Air 2, Global Entry, and Known Crewmember.
    13.Preferred crew bases – Envoy shares hubs with American in Dallas/Fort Worth, Chicago, Miami and New York (La Guardia), with paid hotels for training and commuting.
    14.Direct entry Captain slots for qualified aviators.



    1 - no bonus needed, it’s a real job
    2 - no problem getting pilots so we don’t try to buy them
    3 - don’t have that, frankly... don’t need pay gimmicks
    4 - $38 is industry leadings? We start at $113 per hour
    5 - don’t need that, everybody here is experienced
    6 - don’t need a path, you’re there... but if you do leave it’s with heavy time
    7 - our MX is light years ahead of Envoy
    8 - our instructors are there to help you succeed, not to try to fail you as Envoy is notorious for
    9 - good luck with standby, I’ll waive as I go to my seat.
    10 - when you finally get out of regionals you’ll realize how wrong that statement is
    11 - not needed, our job attracts pilots without gimmicks
    12 - we hire pilots, not student pilots.... not needed
    13 - nothing beats home based
    14 - our new hire FO’s make more than you’re 9 year Captains.

    come on man, it’s apples and oranges. For a regional Envoy ain’t bad, but there are better choices for pilots today.
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    Registered User NoOtPilot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DolphinsFan View Post
    Your twisting the facts. That doesnt apply to people getting hired right now. Take a look at the projections. In 2016, a new hire was projected to flow to AA in less than 5 years. Get your facts strait.
    Letís look at any FOís W-2 form. And you will see the pay cut they take on their 2nd year. Letís stick to the facts.

    If selling the flow is working, why the Increase in bonuses?

    And while we are at it...why donít we talk about the Compass Pilots coming our way?
    Are they coming as street captains or are we going to give them DOH?
    Last edited by NoOtPilot; 11-28-2018 at 10:34 AM.

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