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Thread: The New Order is just pure Marketing & Advertising.

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    Registered User NoOtPilot's Avatar
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    The New Order is just pure Marketing & Advertising.


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    Combined with the airline's previous orders for the E175, this new contract results in a total of 104 E175 jets for American Airlines since 2013. The most recent order took place in May 2018 for 15 aircraft.

    “Houston, We Have a Problem.”

    Nice try Pedro!
    Last edited by NoOtPilot; 11-05-2018 at 03:18 PM.

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    I guess they consider it more "good" debt, but that just makes their upcoming years expense burden that much more concerning with even more interest payments to make along with big pension expenditures. But, I suppose at least it has value in that as a bonus they can point to these acquisitions as another reason no money is left for AA mainline labor and thus kick the can on mechanic and pilot contracts........that is unless unforeseen economic situations arise and they delay the order. I mean how could they now add hundreds of millions requiring even larger profits to pay for it or otherwise anchor themselves with more debt after this ?

    Perhaps it's just another product of assumption and optimism ? But Parker's past demonstrations of assumption and optimism were claims of 5 Billion in annual profits in a good year and 3 Billion in a bad year and look what's happening; AA operating profits are down, while others are up. I think it's more a function of Houston oblivious to obvious red flags and launching on assumption and optimism anyway with too cold a temperature and thinking everything will be OK......unless of course, this is a strategic move like previous aircraft orders before a bankruptcy filing. We shall see..............

    Maybe AAG's O-rings will hold this time, but maybe not. I think one thing's for sure and that's it all hinges on a lot of crossed fingers.

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    American debt is issued at around 4%. If they can get a ROI of 4%+, New debt can in fact be a good debt. A lot of headwind up ahead to sustain 4%+ ROI.

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    Registered User Dacuj's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DumbWithNumbers View Post
    American debt is issued at around 4%. If they can get a ROI of 4%+, New debt can in fact be a good debt. A lot of headwind up ahead to sustain 4%+ ROI.
    Exactly. It is good debt. Don't let beagleboy make you think he's smart with his mile long responses to anybody who doesn't agree with him. He just cut and pastes that stuff over and over and over. Same old BS different day.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DumbWithNumbers View Post
    American debt is issued at around 4%. If they can get a ROI of 4%+, New debt can in fact be a good debt. A lot of headwind up ahead to sustain 4%+ ROI.
    No such thing as "good" debt to an airline with upwards of 22 BILLION of it, because if things don't work out exactly as Parker proclaimed (and they appear to not be), AA is hosed. I think your latest screen name is actually quite apt.
    Last edited by Beagleboy; 11-06-2018 at 01:50 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dacuj View Post
    Exactly. It is good debt. Don't let beagleboy make you think he's smart with his mile long responses to anybody who doesn't agree with him. He just cut and pastes that stuff over and over and over. Same old BS different day.
    ...and in your case, same person, DIFFERENT SCREEN NAME. But..........also same bankruptcy of substance.

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    Registered User Dacuj's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beagleboy View Post
    ...and in your case, same person, DIFFERENT SCREEN NAME. But..........also same bankruptcy of substance.
    You just launch number 2's here all day long and expect your little groupie section to cover for you. Ain't cutting the cheese anymore when you get real pushback that reveals the truth.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dacuj View Post
    You just launch number 2's here all day long........
    When in Rome. You being the emperor here (or so you believe), I'm just adapting to my surroundings.


    Quote Originally Posted by Dacuj View Post
    and expect your little groupie section to cover for you.
    Others can think for themselves without depending on me. They know their world. But...........you sound jealous to me. I can understand, what with being someone who even a starving dog wouldn't follow even if you were carrying a T-bone in your hand.


    Quote Originally Posted by Dacuj View Post
    Ain't cutting the cheese anymore when you get real pushback that reveals the truth.
    ....and I'm sure you know a lot about that with all the fermentation occurring in your digestive tract. You must be a walking distillery.

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    Just so you both guys (or maybe girls) know, I’m not a number 2 for either of you. But it sure is fun to see the overly optimistic Dacuj and overly pessimistic BeagleBoy going at each other.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DumbWithNumbers View Post
    Just so you both guys (or maybe girls) know, I’m not a number 2 for either of you. But it sure is fun to see the overly optimistic Dacuj and overly pessimistic BeagleBoy going at each other.
    You got to get some fun out of life somewhere, yes ?

    If you're at Envoy, it sounds like that is even more important from what I hear more often then not. People will believe what works for them and more importantly will live with what they believe, good or bad. I want to see good for AA, but it's getting more difficult to with each passing day. Q3 was sobering, but I did like the cherry-picking and spin put into the announcement. Just like old times..............

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    Yes, fun is good. You lost me on your point there. I’m glad you are a well wisher for AA with your extreme pessimism. And as for AA selling cherry picked announcement, if that’s what they got to do to raise interest with investors, that’s what they will do. I’d do the same thing, and so would you.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DumbWithNumbers View Post
    Yes, fun is good. You lost me on your point there. I’m glad you are a well wisher for AA with your extreme pessimism. And as for AA selling cherry picked announcement, if that’s what they got to do to raise interest with investors, that’s what they will do. I’d do the same thing, and so would you.
    "Extreme pessimism" ?

    OK, think what you wish. But I think based on what I SEE, not what others WANT me to see (my repeated point here all along). Your admission (deliberate or accidental) soundly demonstrates that (and also is revealing IMO of what function you perform and for whom). To wit, you validate "selling" something that might be overly-inflated and a deflection (cherry-picking) claiming it's necessary and then rationalizing the means to meet the end goal (raising interest with investors). Some would call that deceptive. Others might use the terms "sham" or "con". It's glossing over the unpleasant realities all in the hope of spinning what is marginal into something more attractive, so as to obtain benefit. Does that MAKE it truly attractive or only appear to do so ?

    AAG isn't alone as it's the same sickness that runs through many businesses and Wall St. and the same reason many investors ultimately get the shaft. It's an inherent dysfunctionality that has been embraced for so long it's actually considered normal by those hopelessly sucked into its vortex. But hey, when you've succumbed to believing that because as you also admit, you are all about "running at money", you can see nothing else. Same reason Envoy management neither sees nor cares about the working conditions of its pilots...............because they aren't money (in fact, the opposite) and there is no need to spin.

    Also for the record, I would not do the same. You (and your like-minded money runners) and I are nothing alike. Sure, I like to earn money, but not all of us have the deferred ethical compass necessary to exist in your world. Some of us actually have scruples. Not trying to insult you even though you may take it that way, but your post here leaves me to see you no other way as (again), I simply call them as I see them and I see you and I see Parker and I see AA.

    Not what you WANT me to see, but what I cannot help BUT see.
    Last edited by Beagleboy; 11-06-2018 at 03:23 PM.

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    My friend (with your permission, if I may address you a friend), your fingers must have hurt with that long post. To save us time, let me just agree with what you said. Cheers. 🍻

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    Quote Originally Posted by DumbWithNumbers View Post
    My friend (with your permission, if I may address you a friend), your fingers must have hurt with that long post. To save us time, let me just agree with what you said. Cheers. 
    Agree with this. Totally a pessimistic narcissist. Gets plenty of kicks being the "Yoda" of this forum and has about 4 lackey groupies who immediately jump in and defend him or back him up with, "Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. You're right Beagle. Right on brother. Tell em." The fact is, the 10% rule at Envoy DOES exist and is alive and well here. 10% of Envoy pilots are overly pessimistic and follow the BS guidance given by some here. 90% are happy with their positions and especially happy with the flow through to American Airlines. Envoy is THE BEST career choice out there for aspiring airline pilots and Beagleboy knows it. He was unfortunately trapped in the lost decade and never saw the benefits of AAG and the flow through. CAVEAT EMPTOR!

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    Quote Originally Posted by DumbWithNumbers View Post
    My friend (with your permission, if I may address you a friend), your fingers must have hurt with that long post. To save us time, let me just agree with what you said. Cheers. 🍻
    Agreement not necessary and I have no enemies. I think you should come to your own conclusions and if they differ from mine, that’s OK. Fingers are fine, but thanks for the concern. Really.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dacuj View Post
    Agree with this. Totally a pessimistic narcissist. Gets plenty of kicks being the "Yoda" of this forum and has about 4 lackey groupies who immediately jump in and defend him or back him up with, "Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. You're right Beagle. Right on brother. Tell em." The fact is, the 10% rule at Envoy DOES exist and is alive and well here. 10% of Envoy pilots are overly pessimistic and follow the BS guidance given by some here. 90% are happy with their positions and especially happy with the flow through to American Airlines. Envoy is THE BEST career choice out there for aspiring airline pilots and Beagleboy knows it. He was unfortunately trapped in the lost decade and never saw the benefits of AAG and the flow through. CAVEAT EMPTOR!
    Ahh,......the old ‘divide and conquer’ approach. I suspect you’ll fail at this just like almost everything else you’ve undertaken. Give Jerry a call.........I think he can fine tune your assault a bit, not that it will make a difference in your case Mongo.

    A pawn in life never becomes anything else. You will always be a pawn.

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