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Thread: Spirit AIP

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    Spirit AIP


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    Subject: Agreement in Principle Reached

    Fellow Pilots:

    We are pleased to announce that late Friday an Agreement-in-Principle (AIP) was reached with Spirit Airlines. The final AIP added $56 million to the package offered by the Company in September.
    While many sections have already been tentatively agreed to, the next step is to convert the remaining AIPs into final language. The Negotiating Committee anticipates a two-week process for this step. Last year, the Hawaiian Tentative Agreement (TA) language came 4 days after they reached an AIP, Southwest took almost a month.

    Following an agreement on final TA language by both parties, the Negotiating Committee will present the TA to the MEC for formal consideration and decision on whether to send it out to the pilot group for a ratification vote. Each active member in good standing will then be asked to participate in the democratic process of our union and decide whether to ratify the agreement.

    Please know that there will be plenty of time to read the final TA language, attend road shows outlining the changes, and have questions answered before voting. Our communications team has been developing a TA information website which we will launch if the MEC approves the TA. There will also be a direct TA questions email address.

    Between now and the release of the full TA language, and the road shows and supporting information, we highly encourage you to refrain from engaging in speculation about the details of the agreement. If you are not getting your information from the Negotiating Committee it is not reliable! We urge everyone to wait for clear facts.

    MEC members are already receiving calls, texts, emails requesting details. The MEC is under a gag order from the National Mediation Board and cannot reveal any of the details of the AIP.

    For now, we include a highlight of the key economic aspects of the AIP. The Negotiating Committee will provide details as soon as the TA language is final.

    ● Scope: Industry standard protections including improvements in the areas of merger and/or acquisition, successorship, and code sharing.

    ● Average 43% increase in pay rates on date of signing (DOS).

    ● Industry standard 12 year pay scale


    Hourly Rate
    Estimated Effective Rate with A321 Override

    Top Captain DOS
    $237.50
    $242.97

    Top Captain DOS+4
    $259.60
    $264.35

    10 Year CA DOS
    $224.13
    $229.28

    10 Year CA DOS+4
    $244.98
    $250.61

    5th Year FO DOS
    $125.73
    $128.62

    5th Year FO DOS+4
    $137.42
    $140.58

    2nd Year FO DOS
    $104.42
    $106.83

    ● Direct Contribution to 401K of 11% DOS; 12% DOS+1; 13% DOS+3; 14% DOS+3; 15% DOS+4.

    ● Company retirement contributions in excess of IRS limits will be paid directly to the pilot.

    ● $75 million distributed to the pilot group upon ratification.
    ● Retained one of the industry leading healthcare provisions with no change to the cost structure.

    ● Industry standard rig package with PBS, including 5-hour minimum duty period average, 1:2 duty rig, 1:3.5, additional duty period credit for layovers in excess of 24 hours.

    ● Current rigs maintained until PBS. The cash value of the 5-hour minimum duty period average from DOS to PBS added to retro payment.

    ● Increased sick leave accrual to 5 hours per month and bank limit to 700 hours.

    ● Industry standard long-term disability (LTD) benefit providing own occupation coverage to mandatory retirement age, with optional buy-up to $15,000/month.

    ● Long Call Reserve

    ● Industry standard fatigue policy with pay protection

    ● Standing Available list replaced with a new system providing 200% pay.

    ● Company designated open trips at 200%

    ● Additional opportunities to earn premium pay.

    PBS LOA requiring mutual agreement in all aspects of PBS except ALPA controls vendor selection. Additional protections/provisions include:

    o Protection against altering the terms and conditions of the CBA due to implementation of PBS.

    o PBS to allow pilots the option to individually waive 4 days off on a 6-month trial basis. ALPA option to retain the individual waiver function.

    o No changes to Red/Green system.

    o Final schedule open time levels guaranteed to remain at current levels

    o JPWG will have remote access to both pairing optimizer and PBS software

    o Improved joint pairing construction

    o Retained industry leading credit options and flexibility for vacation

    o No Position reductions (downgrades or furloughs) as a result of PBS

    o PBS implementation scheduled for 12 months following vendor selection.

    o Company paid ALPA leave, positive space travel, hotel and per diem for ALPA members of the JPWG

    o Expedited dispute resolution process requiring the arbitrator to give special consideration to mainline carriers using the same PBS vendor.

    We look forward to sharing full details with you in the near future. Until then we urge you to stick to the facts, address your questions to your reps and Negotiating Committee members, and continue to do the outstanding and professional work you do each day.
    In unity,

    MEC signatures
    __________________________________________________ __

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cujo665 View Post
    Subject: Agreement in Principle Reached

    Fellow Pilots:

    We are pleased to announce that late Friday an Agreement-in-Principle (AIP) was reached with Spirit Airlines. The final AIP added $56 million to the package offered by the Company in September.
    While many sections have already been tentatively agreed to, the next step is to convert the remaining AIPs into final language. The Negotiating Committee anticipates a two-week process for this step. Last year, the Hawaiian Tentative Agreement (TA) language came 4 days after they reached an AIP, Southwest took almost a month.

    Following an agreement on final TA language by both parties, the Negotiating Committee will present the TA to the MEC for formal consideration and decision on whether to send it out to the pilot group for a ratification vote. Each active member in good standing will then be asked to participate in the democratic process of our union and decide whether to ratify the agreement.

    Please know that there will be plenty of time to read the final TA language, attend road shows outlining the changes, and have questions answered before voting. Our communications team has been developing a TA information website which we will launch if the MEC approves the TA. There will also be a direct TA questions email address.

    Between now and the release of the full TA language, and the road shows and supporting information, we highly encourage you to refrain from engaging in speculation about the details of the agreement. If you are not getting your information from the Negotiating Committee it is not reliable! We urge everyone to wait for clear facts.

    MEC members are already receiving calls, texts, emails requesting details. The MEC is under a gag order from the National Mediation Board and cannot reveal any of the details of the AIP.

    For now, we include a highlight of the key economic aspects of the AIP. The Negotiating Committee will provide details as soon as the TA language is final.

    ● Scope: Industry standard protections including improvements in the areas of merger and/or acquisition, successorship, and code sharing.

    ● Average 43% increase in pay rates on date of signing (DOS).

    ● Industry standard 12 year pay scale


    Hourly Rate
    Estimated Effective Rate with A321 Override

    Top Captain DOS
    $237.50
    $242.97

    Top Captain DOS+4
    $259.60
    $264.35

    10 Year CA DOS
    $224.13
    $229.28

    10 Year CA DOS+4
    $244.98
    $250.61

    5th Year FO DOS
    $125.73
    $128.62

    5th Year FO DOS+4
    $137.42
    $140.58

    2nd Year FO DOS
    $104.42
    $106.83

    ● Direct Contribution to 401K of 11% DOS; 12% DOS+1; 13% DOS+3; 14% DOS+3; 15% DOS+4.

    ● Company retirement contributions in excess of IRS limits will be paid directly to the pilot.

    ● $75 million distributed to the pilot group upon ratification.
    ● Retained one of the industry leading healthcare provisions with no change to the cost structure.

    ● Industry standard rig package with PBS, including 5-hour minimum duty period average, 1:2 duty rig, 1:3.5, additional duty period credit for layovers in excess of 24 hours.

    ● Current rigs maintained until PBS. The cash value of the 5-hour minimum duty period average from DOS to PBS added to retro payment.

    ● Increased sick leave accrual to 5 hours per month and bank limit to 700 hours.

    ● Industry standard long-term disability (LTD) benefit providing own occupation coverage to mandatory retirement age, with optional buy-up to $15,000/month.

    ● Long Call Reserve

    ● Industry standard fatigue policy with pay protection

    ● Standing Available list replaced with a new system providing 200% pay.

    ● Company designated open trips at 200%

    ● Additional opportunities to earn premium pay.

    PBS LOA requiring mutual agreement in all aspects of PBS except ALPA controls vendor selection. Additional protections/provisions include:

    o Protection against altering the terms and conditions of the CBA due to implementation of PBS.

    o PBS to allow pilots the option to individually waive 4 days off on a 6-month trial basis. ALPA option to retain the individual waiver function.

    o No changes to Red/Green system.

    o Final schedule open time levels guaranteed to remain at current levels

    o JPWG will have remote access to both pairing optimizer and PBS software

    o Improved joint pairing construction

    o Retained industry leading credit options and flexibility for vacation

    o No Position reductions (downgrades or furloughs) as a result of PBS

    o PBS implementation scheduled for 12 months following vendor selection.

    o Company paid ALPA leave, positive space travel, hotel and per diem for ALPA members of the JPWG

    o Expedited dispute resolution process requiring the arbitrator to give special consideration to mainline carriers using the same PBS vendor.

    We look forward to sharing full details with you in the near future. Until then we urge you to stick to the facts, address your questions to your reps and Negotiating Committee members, and continue to do the outstanding and professional work you do each day.
    In unity,

    MEC signatures
    And yet we get flow that's crawling at a snail's pace. Absolutely pathetic how everyone else is getting raises and QOL fixes and we get metered flow.

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    Quote Originally Posted by eaglepilot View Post
    And yet we get flow that's crawling at a snail's pace. Absolutely pathetic how everyone else is getting raises and QOL fixes and we get metered flow.
    They have a union and things like this tend to happen with reasonably decent unions. Impotent “Associations” littered with the self-concerned, not so much.

    From my understanding, some of Spirit pilots AIP is better then AA pilots, but others are still short, but not by much. This presents an interesting situation for many Envoy pilots. I think every Envoy pilot considering the flow should compare the financials between AA and Spirit, especially a recent hire should look forward say.......20 years. On one side estimate Envoy pay for 9 years and AA pay for 11 with 6-7 as narrow body F/O and 4-5 as narrowbody captain. 9 years from now AA will have hired almost half again their current pilot count or upwards of perhaps 6,000 pilots and you’ll be behind all those pilots and most will be fairly young. Then estimate say........going to Spirit in 2 years and being an F/O there for 4 years and a captain for 14 years. Point is, going to Spirit sooner will almost certainly be more financially rewarding in the long run over AA if you’re going to wait almost a decade to get to AA and have many thousands of younger (those in 30’s up to early 40’s) pilots already ahead of you. For some pilots, Spirit might be the better bet.
    Last edited by Beagleboy; 01-23-2018 at 11:08 AM.

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    I think it’s taking gojet pilots about 3 years to flow to spirit.

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    Rates might look good but Spirit is a s**tbag operation. Essentially you are selling your soul for payrates and will be treated like a piece of meat after getting on property. Giving up a spot at AA for this is like cutting your arm off just to get paid 500k.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DolphinsFan View Post
    Rates might look good but Spirit is a s**tbag operation. Essentially you are selling your soul for payrates and will be treated like a piece of meat after getting on property. Giving up a spot at AA for this is like cutting your arm off just to get paid 500k.
    LOL you are such a clown. Funny guy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DolphinsFan View Post
    Rates might look good but Spirit is a s**tbag operation. Essentially you are selling your soul for payrates and will be treated like a piece of meat after getting on property. Giving up a spot at AA for this is like cutting your arm off just to get paid 500k.
    You obviously haven't talked to any pilots thay work there. That is the one thing spirit has going for them.... they treat there pilots well. Most enjoy working there and love the QOL improvements over what envoy or even AA offers.

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    Quote Originally Posted by wiz5422 View Post
    You obviously haven't talked to any pilots thay work there. That is the one thing spirit has going for them.... they treat there pilots well. Most enjoy working there and love the QOL improvements over what envoy or even AA offers.
    Just ignore him. He's not who he acts like he is, he's just a random line dude getting his rocks off on trolling a message board.

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    Quote Originally Posted by wiz5422 View Post
    You obviously haven't talked to any pilots thay work there. That is the one thing spirit has going for them.... they treat there pilots well. Most enjoy working there and love the QOL improvements over what envoy or even AA offers.
    .......nor any AA pilots regarding how things are shaping up there. Looks to me like if you are unfortunate to lose your medical, you're twice as better off at Spirit then AA and if that occurs at Eagle while you are waiting a decade to flow, you'll be getting not so much as a "thanks for playing" handshake as you head off to fill out your Home Depot application. That alone can mean for some Spirit is a safer bet too. Fact is, the other legacies like Delta, United, Southwest, UPS and FedEx are beyond AA in terms of overall compensation and the LCC's like Spirit and soon Jet Blue and others will catch AA and in some areas surpass AA. AA is shaping up to be the "Walmart" of large jet pilot employers where size doesn't really matter anymore.

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    Might just be time to polish up that Spirit Airlines Application and submit it. That all sounds quite nice!

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    Rumor is United is all over Spirit.
    What is the probability of getting to AA faster from Spirit than Envoy?
    Last edited by NoOtPilot; 01-23-2018 at 06:45 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by NoOtPilot View Post
    Rumor is United is all over Spirit.
    What is the probability of getting to AA faster from Spirit than Envoy?
    What do you mean United is "all over Spirit?"

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jersdawg View Post
    What do you mean United is "all over Spirit?"
    Again RUMORS on the street, behind management desks, possible acquisition/integration/merger.
    RUMOR.
    I always tell the truth. Even when I lie.

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    I give that rumor about as much credibility as TSH being rumored to acquire NASA.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sirsnacksalot View Post
    I give that rumor about as much credibility as TSH being rumored to acquire NASA.
    In this era of consolidation, it's not even remotely outlandish. Who actually thinks these LCCs will not be gobbled up by the large network carriers in the coming years?

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    Quote Originally Posted by xpanterica View Post
    In this era of consolidation, it's not even remotely outlandish. Who actually thinks these LCCs will not be gobbled up by the large network carriers in the coming years?
    Who’s to say they’re not gonna outlive that prediction ala SWA?

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    Quote Originally Posted by DolphinsFan View Post
    Rates might look good but Spirit is a s**tbag operation. Essentially you are selling your soul for payrates and will be treated like a piece of meat after getting on property. Giving up a spot at AA for this is like cutting your arm off just to get paid 500k.
    ...meanwhile at AA I personally know a pilot who has been reassigned every day he has worked since the week before Christmas till today.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jdflyer View Post
    ...meanwhile at AA I personally know a pilot who has been reassigned every day he has worked since the week before Christmas till today.
    “Keep your heads up gents and ladies, in my brief time here so far it's night and day from ENY.“

    ~JDflyer~
    😂😂

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    Quote Originally Posted by NoOtPilot View Post
    “Keep your heads up gents and ladies, in my brief time here so far it's night and day from ENY.“

    ~JDflyer~
    😂😂
    That doesn’t sound like anything I’ve ever written. Could you please let me know where that quote came from?

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    I believe there is two jd’s

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