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Thread: Get Excited...Growths a cominí

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    I asked this same question months ago. I also added the question of how many new hires make it to their 1 year mark. Whether it be by washing out or leaving for another carrier. Iíd love to see that number.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pinkvisual View Post
    I asked this same question months ago. I also added the question of how many new hires make it to their 1 year mark. Whether it be by washing out or leaving for another carrier. Iíd love to see that number.
    Iíva asked it as well of anyone in the know. If anything, Envoy ALPA should be disseminating such info, but I strongly suspect they donít want to rock the boat. Better for all involved if pilots are mushrooms if past history is any indication.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Beagleboy View Post
    Iíva asked it as well of anyone in the know. If anything, Envoy ALPA should be disseminating such info, but I strongly suspect they donít want to rock the boat. Better for all involved if pilots are mushrooms if past history is any indication.
    I had to work today. Spent about 4 hours in the office playing catch up. Then I notice that on Thanksgiving of all days, beagleboy is on here doing what he has done for the past FIVE years. Beat the same old tired drum about how Envoy is on the edge of imploding and the flow is about to cave. Guess what? We are getting more new hires than EVER before and are actually GROWING by leaps and bounds. The implosion you so fervently desire hasnít happened nor will it ever happen. Envoy is rock solid with our fleet plan, pilot group, growth, new hires and most of all.......FLOW. Get over it you grouchy a** Envoy hater. The demise of Envoy ainít happening.

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    Youíll attract more flies with honey than sh!t

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dacuj View Post
    I had to work today. Spent about 4 hours in the office playing catch up. Then I notice that on Thanksgiving of all days, beagleboy is on here doing what he has done for the past FIVE years. Beat the same old tired drum about how Envoy is on the edge of imploding and the flow is about to cave. Guess what? We are getting more new hires than EVER before and are actually GROWING by leaps and bounds. The implosion you so fervently desire hasnít happened nor will it ever happen. Envoy is rock solid with our fleet plan, pilot group, growth, new hires and most of all.......FLOW. Get over it you grouchy a** Envoy hater. The demise of Envoy ainít happening.
    Try to keep it under a 12-pack tonight. Hungover Turkeys such as yourself are a sad sight indeed. Besides, youíve got your work cut out for you over the next month convincing Envoy pilots the coal in their stockings are in fact tickets to flow to AA.

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    From RW mouth. - ďI donít care about endeavors Pay scaleĒ during the smoozing pizza party earlier this week.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BOHICA View Post
    Youíll attract more flies with honey than sh!t
    Uhhh, not necessarily.

    **** flies.jpg
    Last edited by CRJ700; 11-23-2017 at 06:18 PM.

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    Is envoy growing by leaps and bounds? I know classes are full but whatís the actual month to month growth on the list?

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    Oh that changes,weekly if not daily with those failing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DilsonWic View Post
    From RW mouth. - ďI donít care about endeavors Pay scaleĒ during the smoozing pizza party earlier this week.
    He will care soon!!!
    You will see.
    😈😈😈

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    Of course they don't care about Endeavor's pay scales as long as they keep attracting the suckers who think they will be at AA in 5-6 years. The Endeavor contract isn't even about pay, a good contract not only focuses on pay but more importantly WORK RULES as well. Looking at the TA, they have a regional airline contract that Envoy cannot compete with only flow. While pilots wait for flow wouldn't it be nice to have good reserve work rules? Commutable trips? Rigs? A contract that makes working at a regional tolerable?

    Envoy will not invest in it's pilots period. Keep beating that flow drum, hope it works out for you.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Standby4life View Post
    Of course they don't care about Endeavor's pay scales as long as they keep attracting the suckers who think they will be at AA in 5-6 years. The Endeavor contract isn't even about pay, a good contract not only focuses on pay but more importantly WORK RULES as well. Looking at the TA, they have a regional airline contract that Envoy cannot compete with only flow. While pilots wait for flow wouldn't it be nice to have good reserve work rules? Commutable trips? Rigs? A contract that makes working at a regional tolerable?

    Envoy will not invest in it's pilots period. Keep beating that flow drum, hope it works out for you.
    Since the supply of entry-level captains and F/O's for the regional industry is all but certain to steadily evaporate, you'd think keeping pilots would be as important as getting them. Apparently, it is the belief here that developing a tolerable environment isn't important as long as the carrot is both big enough, but also kept at just the right distance of the rabbit chasing it, i.e., a distance where the rabbit cannot quite get at it, but still smell it. IMO, that flawed strategy will be a major component of what puts Envoy at greater risk of decline vs. other regionals in the future. The time will soon come when a regional airline must consider their pilots as a precious commodity in which the viability of their business depends on and the carriers late to that realization or have a longer road to correct past disregard and damage in that area will suffer more. I think it obvious few carriers out there (at least among large RJ operators who must be the ones to survive) are more challenged in that area then Envoy. The present strategy is doomed to fail IMO and that will not just be bad for Envoy, but AA (and thus AA pilots) as well.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dacuj View Post
    Your argument holds no water as usual. Growth is good. More Captains equals more FOs equals flow clicking along like a well oiled machine. In case you missed it, new hires are flocking to Envoy like flies to s**t.
    Growth is good for the company.

    Growth is both good and bad for the pilots. Growth with a stagnant rate of flow via metering equals longer time to flow.

    Flow is currently 7.5 years to flow for a new hire and increasing.

    The pluses for the pilots via growth: upgrades, stable airline etc. None of which out weigh and increased time to flow.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Capt John Bravo View Post
    Flow is currently 7.5 years to flow for a new hire and increasing
    Closer to 9. The list stops at 8.11 since the projections don't go past December 2025 on the seniority list (a glitch).

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    I won't argue that. It's been 3 months since I've seen the company's numbers.

    But it is projected to increase as envoy grows. The company know this. They are hoping they don't have to deal with it.

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    Having a brain fart. How does one see the projected flow date of the pp group? For some reason I can only see the 824 guys

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    To go the interactive list. Click the AA tab at the top.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DilsonWic View Post
    To go the interactive list. Click the AA tab at the top.
    The system seniority list has it, too. Just a different format.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Capt John Bravo View Post
    I won't argue that. It's been 3 months since I've seen the company's numbers.

    But it is projected to increase as envoy grows. The company know this. They are hoping they don't have to deal with it.
    They are hoping the word isn't getting out that flow is 9+ years and increasing every new hire class.

    The latest class had 54 - that flow group will be 17/month if we are 2000 pilots - that's a four month spread from senior to junior guy in that class.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DilsonWic View Post
    From RW mouth. - ďI donít care about endeavors Pay scaleĒ during the smoozing pizza party earlier this week.
    He can care now and get ahead of the curve or he can care later, after the damage is done, according to what I hear. Wonder which way heíll go? If AAG would flow the maximum (even for those /()&$(;($&ing :$@@;:/;@Ďs at PoSA) and match + exceed the Endeavor (or anybody else for the foreseeable future) agreement theyíd be guaranteed to rake in months of new hires. As it is most that we hire are counting the days to get back to DFW. That base is the draw, flow isnít even tertiary as far as most are concerned.
    Warlord of the crewroom.

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