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Thread: MESA - now Leading the industry with passed TA

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    MESA - now Leading the industry with passed TA


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    Copied over from APC. Leading the industry as always:

    Here is a sunmary:

    CRJ900 and 900 Classic become one payrate after two years. (76/79 seat).

    MEC voted it in 7-1 to send to pilots.

    200 pay gone, all soft time will be paid at 76 seat rate first two years then 79 seat pay after the payscale merges.

    FO pay 36/hr starting.

    Actual block or better per flight leg.

    Hotel language with short & Long overnights as well as giving the hotel committee control over decisions and forcing the company to maintain a more watchful eye.

    Aggressive reserve pickup.

    Short Call (2hr), Long Call (12-18hr)

    Bidding opens 10th, schedules out 19th.

    Layovers of 28 hours or more have 2.0 hours added to the pairing.


    Max CRJ 900 CA Pay year 1 of contract is 108.00, max CA pay after 5 years is $114.35

    Max FO pay is $52.00 year 1, $53.50 year 5.

    People can bid from seat to seat, captains only, only 1% a year, so for 1100 pilots 11 people. Then you are seat locked for 3 years with a 1 year training contract.

    Contract increases yearly, on top of structured rate. Raises 6 months before contract ends, and then 1% raise per year until a new contract is settled.

    Parking is paid for if you commute.

    Commuter clause up to 4x.

    Deadhead pay 62.5%

    Per diem 1.60 plus $40 a month for iPads in per diem. Goes up by .5c every year on top of CPI.

    401k 0-9 years company matches 50% of to 6% of pilot contribution.

    10+ years company matches 50% of up to 10% of pilot contribution.

    Company must now present buffer numbers to union and reasoning to make sure no unreasonable numbers are attained.

    Min guarantee increases from 75.83 to 76

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    Leading? Um....

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    Yes but no mention of flow.

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    With 30000 pilots retiring in next ten years, all regionals have a flow. It's called supply and demand. Mainline has more demand than there is a supply, everyone is flowing quicker than the 7 year flow. These guys will be senior to an envoy pilot flowing in 7 years, they will have higher pay, better schedules and better QOL then an envoy pilot flows to swing the gear for the pilots that did not wait for flow.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ardvark View Post
    With 30000 pilots retiring in next ten years, all regionals have a flow. It's called supply and demand. Mainline has more demand than there is a supply, everyone is flowing quicker than the 7 year flow. These guys will be senior to an envoy pilot flowing in 7 years, they will have higher pay, better schedules and better QOL then an envoy pilot flows to swing the gear for the pilots that did not wait for flow.
    Only a matter of time before Delta and United choke the poaching by AAG involving their regionals. When, not if......it gets bad enough they will have no choice but to act.

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    I don't even know where to start with this. There are so many things wrong here. The first and most obvious is that it's MESA. The old saying is you can put lipstick on a pig but.......it's still a pig. The most glaring and prominent issue here is that they don't have FLOW to AMERICAN AIRLINES.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dacuj View Post
    I don't even know where to start with this. There are so many things wrong here.
    Finally admitting Envoy has a lot of issues when it comes to pilot treatment ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dacuj View Post
    The first and most obvious is that it's MESA. The old saying is you can put lipstick on a pig but.......it's still a pig. The most glaring and prominent issue here is that they don't have FLOW to AMERICAN AIRLINES.
    So if Envoy had no flow, would it then be an oinker in the pen ? I mean.........your primary porcine squeal involves the flow, so without it, it would seem to be about equal to Mesa QWL-wise, yes ? Contractual comparison and treatment wise (judging by the complaints), you have to admit, it's a valid perception.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Beagleboy View Post
    Finally admitting Envoy has a lot of issues when it comes to pilot treatment ?

    Not admitting anything of the sort. The false narrative about Envoy QOL is being pushed by YOU and others here are just piling on.


    So if Envoy had no flow, would it then be an oinker in the pen ? I mean.........your primary porcine squeal involves the flow, so without it, it would seem to be about equal to Mesa QWL-wise, yes ? Contractual comparison and treatment wise (judging by the complaints), you have to admit, it's a valid perception.
    "If" Envoy had no flow, our entire operation is far and above anything Mesa has to offer. You would be a total IDIOT to choose any regional outside of Envoy.

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    The QOL issues are noted by pilots flying the line every day. I haven't met a single line pilot who doesn't feel there are major QOL issues. The flow makes envoy a better option at the moment for many, but stop spouting your ridiculous rhetoric about the rainbows and show ponies at envoy. You would do much better to acknowledge the issues facing the company that management has the power to fix yet chooses not to while at the same time pointing out the positive aspects of employment at envoy. Prospective new hires can tell that you're disingenuous and that hurts our recruitment. Please stop lying about envoy so that we can attract new hires. Your constant lies are going to make new hires question our moral integrity when it is just you (and phinfan, I suppose) who is full of it and a snake oil salesman.

    Envoy is the best option for many, and I'm glad I'm here, mostly due to the flow, BUT(!) there are MAJOR (!) issues affecting QOL that management should address. Once the other majors introduce flow we will be back in last place.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dacuj View Post
    "If" Envoy had no flow, our entire operation is far and above anything Mesa has to offer. You would be a total IDIOT to choose any regional outside of Envoy.
    There are thousands of idiots out there in regionaland then. If only all of them subscribed to your belief that Envoy is to the airline industry what water is to humanity, eh ?

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    Quote Originally Posted by ardvark View Post
    With 30000 pilots retiring in next ten years, all regionals have a flow. It's called supply and demand. Mainline has more demand than there is a supply, everyone is flowing quicker than the 7 year flow. These guys will be senior to an envoy pilot flowing in 7 years, they will have higher pay, better schedules and better QOL then an envoy pilot flows to swing the gear for the pilots that did not wait for flow.
    Agree mostly except for trying to get hired at AA.

    AA is on the record that half their hiring will be flow. Out of the remaining half, the street hires will be 75% will be military and 25% civilian trained.

    So out of all of the seats in AA class only 12.5% will be civilian trained street hires. That doesn't bode well for Mesa pilots to get hired at AA
    Last edited by Mr mojo; 07-12-2017 at 11:35 PM.

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    I've flown with very good, competent, professional former Mesa Pilots who are now at the majors. They'll all do fine and have good career prospects at AA or elsewhere.

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    My post wasn't specific to Mesa pilots. It applies to any off the street civilian trained pilot trying to get on at AA.

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    Fair enough, however you specifically mention Mesa pilots in your last sentence.

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    Well. The thread is about mesa. So any non wholly owned, including mesa, will have a hard time coming off the street to AA.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hapless Browny View Post
    Fair enough, however you specifically mention Mesa pilots in your last sentence.
    I did mention them, but I didn't refer to their abilities or their professionalism. I simply mentioned the lack of class space for OTS civilian trained pilots. I said MESA because a previous poster mentioned they would have no problem getting hired at the big three.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DilsonWic View Post
    Well. The thread is about mesa. So any non wholly owned, including mesa, will have a hard time coming off the street to AA.
    Correct

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    I guess the idea here is that AA is the only major airline?

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    No. Just the only American Airlines. Believe it or not, it's some people's 1st choice major.

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    Quote Originally Posted by EGF View Post
    I guess the idea here is that AA is the only major airline?
    Nope but it's a large piece of the pie and has the highest rate of retirements.

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